[jinzo64]

very simple which do prefer rukia or orihime
http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/mm50/b1uttercup/hime%20pics%20park%203/Orihime_by_TheDarknessWolf.png

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:4mq418n0VK7G5M:http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n6/ichigo00093/rukia.png&t=1

[LOLWTFBBQ]

Orihime all the way, though lately Ive been more interested in Tatsuki

[jinzo64]

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:k9j0pewqQqTI8M:http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc195/Ulquiorrra/Tatsuki.jpg&t=1

you mean this young lady shes hot.

[hosokawa37]

Yeah, shes not bad looking either. I like Rukia and Yuroichi better both in personality, and looks, lol.

[jinzo64]

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_5mtfk_BzA2c/S4pCZW32eZI/AAAAAAAAAio/wW0mhH33UEU/s400/Yoruichi-Shihouin.jpg

changed mine so here yoruichi

[hosokawa37]

I fixed it, but i meant Yuroichi, the one who was the cat at the beginning lol. My bad.

[abyssion1337]

that's an easy easy easy choice, Orihime is an unlikable bitch who should be renamed McGuffin Queen

[DXM]

Orihime. The whole necrophilia thing kills it for me with Rukia.

[Chillpalazzo]

Rukia I guess. But the real question is Ryoko or Aeka... Damn I feel old school.

[Backmask]

I would vote, but I find most of the girls from Bleach to be unattractive.

[abyssion1337]

That's because Tite Kubo has a real problem when it comes to writing likable female characters

[Evileel]

Rukia is flat. I would never vote for her.
http://en.academic.ru/pictures/enwiki/76/Loituma.gif

[BladeGraffiti]

Rukia I guess. But the real question is Ryoko or Aeka... Damn I feel old school.

Chill i'll always go with ryoko, ALWAYS! well between these two specifically it would have to be rukia since i can't stand carrot top ovar thar....

[LOLWTFBBQ]

that's an easy easy easy choice, Orihime is an unlikable bitch who should be renamed McGuffin Queen

dude, Orihime is so kind, humble and innocent compared to pretty much all the other female characters in Bleach, especialy Rukia.

Rukia used to be awesome when she was more powerful and inteligent than Ichigo, but after she gets rescued she sucked bad and became really underpowered, still not changing the bitchy attitude.

but sense other people are posting hawt bleach females here I would also have to go with lieutenant #8 Ise Nanao. (what is it about squad 8 and glasses?)

http://img534.imageshack.us/img534/1131/290pxnanao264e6207065.jpg (http://img534.imageshack.us/i/290pxnanao264e6207065.jpg/)

[Backmask]

Too bad every female character in Bleach share the exact same "bitch" trait.

[LOLWTFBBQ]

Too bad every female character in Bleach share the exact same "bitch" trait.

pretty much, I guess its because they all fight and thus all have a tom-boy attitude. even Ichigos female classmates tend toward a masculine defensive resolve

[abyssion1337]

Really, I think they all have different flavors of the bitch trait, and I wouldn't have such a problem with all the tomboys if it weren't for the fact that this was generally coupled with an unlikable attitude/pants on head retardedness

It's not that I hate all of them, some of them follow the general quirkiness rules of the other secondary characters. On the other hand Orihime is the Queen of unlikable female characters, along with being the god of retards

[XxFabiGBxX]

my vote goes to unohana...(WTFF!!??)

[LOLWTFBBQ]

On the other hand Orihime is the Queen of unlikable female characters, along with being the god of retards

why? sure there was at least once I was like "Orihime wtf!? but she doesnt actualy have much personality except to do what shes told act shy and feel sorry for everyone and everything.

actualy have you seen all non-filler content with Orihime in it?

[Evileel]

Omg, he is just striving for attention. Don't take his "arguments" so seriously.
http://makemetheking.com/Joker-Obama.JPG

[BladeGraffiti]

the guys will probably pull a deus machina and become girls themselves
http://fc00.deviantart.com/fs30/f/2008/080/1/6/Bleach_GB_fanart__Girl_Power_by_Rivania.png

[abyssion1337]

honestly, non-filler Orihime is more infuriating than anything else, all she is a walking vita-chamber making the already dull main cast even more dull because she invalidates any injury or death they might have. I know that because of what it is the main characters are always going to win but her presence removes even the slightest bit of suspense.

And to make matters worse she's just poorly written, I've never liked characters who were just doormats and while she may be a doormat with the ability to heal people she's still just that, she's poorly characterized and her mere presence is the sort of thing you should avoid if you want your narrative to have any value.

As I've said the only reason to watch Bleach is that the fight scenes are well done and epic and the secondary characters are all delightfully quirky. The main cast is really bland each sticking to their personal cliche like headcrabs to a zombie.

[LOLWTFBBQ]

where would a character be if they didnt have personality? none of us here have the skill to design a full cast like that of Bleach, and make them all interesting enough without relying on power alone, hence the cliche quirks.

in the end, Rukia has her quirky cliche, Orihime has her quirky cliche, every bleach mofo has a quirky cliche, end of argument.

[BladeGraffiti]

as long as Haruhi approves i have no qualm whatsoever
http://th05.deviantart.net/fs18/PRE/f/2007/209/a/b/Suzumiya_Haruhi_no_Yuuutsu_by_EmadGfx.jpg

[abyssion1337]

where would a character be if they didnt have personality? none of us here have the skill to design a full cast like that of Bleach, and make them all interesting enough without relying on power alone, hence the cliche quirks.

in the end, Rukia has her quirky cliche, Orihime has her quirky cliche, every bleach mofo has a quirky cliche, end of argument.

I agree that this is getting no where and we should probably stop. I will not however agree to the following: None of us here have the skill to design a full cast like that of Bleach and make them all interesting (Note: I don't believe that Tite Kubo has actually done this because of the large number of characters I don't find interesting) I also don't agree that all the characters are a quirky cliche, while it's hard to argue that they're not all cliches, many of them aren't quirky.

[ThePsychoGamer]

where would a character be if they didnt have personality? none of us here have the skill to design a full cast like that of Bleach, and make them all interesting enough without relying on power alone, hence the cliche quirks.

in the end, Rukia has her quirky cliche, Orihime has her quirky cliche, every bleach mofo has a quirky cliche, end of argument.

I'm pretty sure design would only apply to the artwork, considering that the argument has been primary about the writing and narrative. Also don't assume that everyone on this forum are black holes of creativity.

[LOLWTFBBQ]

Also don't assume that everyone on this forum are black holes of creativity.

well thats why were here isnt it?;)

but Im simply implying that people shouldnt be smart-asses when it comes to designing cast, plot and character development for a series. Bleach is hugely successful, (same as Naruto and One Peace, which has waaay too many obnoxious characters anyway) among others and supports a massive lineup of characters, pretty much each of which has their own personaly to fit their powers etc. etc.

sure Tite could make better characters, but he designed them like this so as not to overshadow protagonists like Ichigo. so in the end, Tite is a genius for making Characters that wont overshadow, while still making fanboys love them for those quirks.

and speaking of overshadowing Ichigo, thats actualy when I liked Rukia, when she was badass and could own Ichigo if she wanted. now she cant do jack **** and is almost as helpless as Orihime. which is probably why Fade to Black I Call Your Name is such an awesome movie, cuz she kicks his ass.

[abyssion1337]

That's not why were here, most of us are very creative, also I have no idea what you're talking about, almost all of the characters overshadow Ichigo just not in the way of being more powerful, because Ichigo is bland as they come. Tite isn't really a genius so much as he just followed some well established tropes and happened to make something that was successful.

If you want to see something that's actually creative and has a huge line-up of interesting characters just watch Baccano! or Durarara. Let's just not say Bleach is anything but a generic shounen series that just happens to have enough of a budget to make the fight scenes awesome but would still be better if they hadn't tried to be different from Yu Yu Hakusho

[LOLWTFBBQ]

That's not why were here, most of us are very creative, also I have no idea what you're talking about, almost all of the characters overshadow Ichigo just not in the way of being more powerful, because Ichigo is bland as they come. Tite isn't really a genius so much as he just followed some well established tropes and happened to make something that was successful.

If you want to see something that's actually creative and has a huge line-up of interesting characters just watch Baccano! or Durarara. Let's just not say Bleach is anything but a generic shounen series that just happens to have enough of a budget to make the fight scenes awesome but would still be better if they hadn't tried to be different from Yu Yu Hakusho

that was a joke, everyone here has ample creativity because it takes that genius to make these amvs

in reality, yes, Ichigo is bland, he is way too serious, the list goes on and on about his character flaws. but Bleach is a fiction series, so its anything but reality, thats how this bland protagonist can get away with being the most popular guy of the series with more that just power.

you kinda prove my point about Tite. but he didnt happen to make something successful out of luck, he knew what would work and built off of that. think of ZombiePowder as a trial-and-error period, where he was testing what would work, and it failed; so off of what he learned, he built bleach.

I really tire of people saying bleach is a knock-off shonen series. who actualy cares?? Bleach is amazingly successful, which speaks for itself. if you dont like it, dont watch it.

and exactly how does budget determine how awesome a series is?

[DXM]

Orihime is Herc approved
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v200/zegim/nepolot/hercules_pimpin.jpg

[abyssion1337]

Being amazingly successful doesn't mean it speaks for itself, it's merely a testament to how humans are sheep; argumentum ad populum does not work and you'd do well to make an actual argument about Bleach's merits than simply saying 'a lot of people like it, therefore it's good.' Something being fiction does not excuse character flaws, most fictional characters are very interesting flaws included. Your argument is that of a rabid fanboy who has no idea about how to write good characters or construct a good narrative.

Also way to reverse your argument about Tite Kubo, you're also completely misjudging zombie powder, zombie powder was 10 times the manga bleach was and he stopped writing it because the depression he was in at the time ended. A lot of really great works happen when the creator is in a really bad place and while I'm not going to say zombie powder was magnificent it was still reasonably good.

I should probably also respond to your question about budget, in this case it's very important, since the writing isn't really anything special the series has to have good effects and impressive battles to get away with what it does, budget in for that part is huge, it's how the fight scenes flow, and it brings backgrounds to life making a much more visceral experience.

You're completely reversing opinions here and I'm beginning to think you're just trolling

[LOLWTFBBQ]

Being amazingly successful doesn't mean it speaks for itself, it's merely a testament to how humans are sheep; argumentum ad populum does not work and you'd do well to make an actual argument about Bleach's merits than simply saying 'a lot of people like it, therefore it's good.' Something being fiction does not excuse character flaws, most fictional characters are very interesting flaws included. Your argument is that of a rabid fanboy who has no idea about how to write good characters or construct a good narrative.

Also way to reverse your argument about Tite Kubo, you're also completely misjudging zombie powder, zombie powder was 10 times the manga bleach was and he stopped writing it because the depression he was in at the time ended. A lot of really great works happen when the creator is in a really bad place and while I'm not going to say zombie powder was magnificent it was still reasonably good.

I should probably also respond to your question about budget, in this case it's very important, since the writing isn't really anything special the series has to have good effects and impressive battles to get away with what it does, budget in for that part is huge, it's how the fight scenes flow, and it brings backgrounds to life making a much more visceral experience.

You're completely reversing opinions here and I'm beginning to think you're just trolling


ehh.... *sigh* where to begin...

yes being amazingly successful does speak for itself, it means its.... successful (big surprise) but you are right, I hate several amazingly popular franchises and find that those who like said franchises to be losers. but thats beside the point.

I suppose it would be a good idea to state bleaches merrits, but sense you have not produced any bad sides aside from just saying the characters suck, I cant do anything. I need you to actualy state what about Bleach sucks so I can defend it bro, please be specific. (the fact that you know so much about bleach kinda means you dont think it sucks)

comparing me to a rabid fanboy pretty much kills this argument, I have not compared you to negative stuff, so why must you say such things to me? if you dont treat me like Im inteligent then I wont give you the time of day bro.

please define how I reversed my statement about Tite. looking back my conclusions about him still show that I think of him as genius.

I do not misjudge ZP because my judgment is my own. I read it all, I even saved a few pages, cool stuff, but I find it to be shallow and generic, but not actualy bad.

you say bleach "was" a manga, sorry, but Bleach is still going on (latest chapter was awesome, dont you think?)

you say people do best writing under strenuous emotion? true, but look at the classic American comic Peanuts. the writer (forgot his name) was often dealing with a ton of depression, and alot of the time that means Charlie Brown sucks. IMO thats a bad way to write a comic, but that is only one case. how did we get to talking about depression anyway?

budget ONLY applies to anime, not the origional manga, not the story, not the characters, only the artwork (which includes animation of course)

that is what I meant by budget, so as to say that it does not define how awesome a story can be. and after reading the last 40 chapters, it kinda makes the anime rendition boring.

so do me a favor dude, if you think Im trolling, then just walk away. nothing said you have to respond to me, nothing said you have to listen to me, Im not spamming, I just enjoying this debate. dont call me a troll, because your doing the exact same thing, were just talking this out, and I know your having as much fun as myself.

lesson of the day: dont toss your pearls before swine.

[abyssion1337]

I called you a troll because of how uneven you've been in this debate, it just seemed to me that you were making arguments to make arguments. You also seem to be under the mistaken belief that I think Bleach sucks, this is not true however I do think it's exceedingly average. It's saving grace is that many of the secondary cast is so quirky and interesting, yet some of these characters, mostly the female characters fail at this.

yes I was talking about budget as it pertains to the anime, I admit the manga has impressive fight scenes but the budget thing makes the fight scenes from that anime go from awesome to epic, as per the visceral comment I said.

We can drop the depression thing but it came up because he wrote ZP while depressed and stopped once he got better.

I don't think of Tite Kubo as a genius, he's a cool guy to be sure but my final conclusion of bleach is that it's by no means bad but it's not really good, it only stands on it's cool characters none of whom are in the main cast and it's awesome fights. Those aside the plot is bland and cliched, it suffers from boring unkillable hero syndrome and dull unbeatable villian syndrome. In the end it's average and that's just disappointing

[LOLWTFBBQ]

I called you a troll because of how uneven you've been in this debate, it just seemed to me that you were making arguments to make arguments. You also seem to be under the mistaken belief that I think Bleach sucks, this is not true however I do think it's exceedingly average. It's saving grace is that many of the secondary cast is so quirky and interesting, yet some of these characters, mostly the female characters fail at this.

yes I was talking about budget as it pertains to the anime, I admit the manga has impressive fight scenes but the budget thing makes the fight scenes from that anime go from awesome to epic, as per the visceral comment I said.

We can drop the depression thing but it came up because he wrote ZP while depressed and stopped once he got better.

I don't think of Tite Kubo as a genius, he's a cool guy to be sure but my final conclusion of bleach is that it's by no means bad but it's not really good, it only stands on it's cool characters none of whom are in the main cast and it's awesome fights. Those aside the plot is bland and cliched, it suffers from boring unkillable hero syndrome and dull unbeatable villian syndrome. In the end it's average and that's just disappointing



looks like everything has been resolved then. Im know I can be uneven and bounce around a bit, but Im constantly revising my argument to make it more polished. we all have our flaws, none of us are immune to stupid mistakes.

you gotta admit, you enjoyed this debate as much as me right?

I drawed the conclusion that you hate bleach from your words, I guess I was mistaken, sry bro. I guess you could call bleach average, IMO I think its too long and drawn out at times, but w/e.

I totaly understand what your saying about anime budget dude, more framerates, advanced polygons, good cast, all within a weeks time deffinately calls for a large budget to make the most of it.

one think everyone has to get used to about Bleach is that none of the good guys die!! its probably the most frustrating thing about bleach! every character carries around 40 gallons of blood to spare and amazingly OP unbalanced characters. I think its far from average and can be quite exciting, and thats just the difference between me and you

[Backmask]

......I hate Bleach.....

[Kajimura]

......I hate Bleach.....

hate is a pretty strong word, are you going to back that up with any reason, or are you just going to leave it at that?

[jinzo64]

some people have gone of track here oh well never mind
there seems to be alot of love for rukia

[Backmask]

hate is a pretty strong word, are you going to back that up with any reason, or are you just going to leave it at that?

Well, the show started good, but, after a while, the plot got boring because they made the story go on longer than it should have. It seems Bleach's story just chose to do things the Naruto and Pokemon way. All Bleach is doing is just writing itself into a dark tunnel.

[jinzo64]

hmm if you take out the filler series 4,5,10,11 it's not that long the three series are important and features some of ichigos most important character building fights he fights ikkaku,rengi,zaraki,byakuya and gets pwned by aizen
also in japan bleach is definatly coming to an epic finally.

[Backmask]

Finally.

[jinzo64]

what do you mean finaly it's only about 300 episodes how many episodes is one peice going to be.

[Backmask]

I wish I knew. I wish I could say "finally" to Naruto, Pokemon, and One Piece, though.

[jinzo64]

naruto ended it's now naruto shippoden:sweatdrop:
pokemon will probably go on forever same with one peice

[Backmask]

Let me correct myself, I WISH I could say "finally" to the whole Naruto series, One Piece, and Pokemon.

[jinzo64]

they'll all end one day

[BladeGraffiti]

yeah but the reruns are eternal

[jinzo64]

yeah reruns

[LOLWTFBBQ]

some day when its all dubbed and we can think back upon where each of those series are at now and throw up.

who else thinks the list should be expanded to all the females in bleach for a better choice?

[Kajimura]

who else thinks the list should be expanded to all the females in bleach for a better choice?

i completely agree wit dat

[PhantomRonin]

Chill i'll always go with ryoko, ALWAYS! well between these two specifically it would have to be rukia since i can't stand carrot top ovar thar....

Washu ftw! Orihime ftw!

[jinzo64]

but it's a realy big list.
but maybe soon.

[abyssion1337]

Clearly my vote should go to Kino

[jinzo64]

http://media-cards.theotaku.com/540190-20090723165000.jpg